eclectic_boy: (Default)
[personal profile] eclectic_boy
I just rode in on the R3 ^H^H^H Media line with Vukan Vuchic, who a mutual friend introduced me to.
He too thinks the elimination of color coding on SEPTA's trains is ludicrous, and thinks someone should have been fired for making the type size on the train's signs unreadably small. On the other hand, he continues to defend his nomenclature system, saying that it's just like the Market-Frankford: you need to know which end of the line you should head to.

I agree with him almost entirely...

Date: 2011-01-28 08:23 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] david chaplin-loebell (from livejournal.com)
I agree about the elimination of color coding, and I agree about the type size.

On the other hand, I think the R system was losing its utility as SEPTA created more and more trains that started out on one branch and switched to another at Center City-- for awhile my daily commute was on a train that started at Chestnut Hill West but had an R6 Norristown sign on it because that's where it was eventually going to go. That way madness lies! And the fact that this is possible is what makes it different from the Market-Frankford.

There are aspect's of Vuchic's original plan I've never understood, too-- what was with the little bit of R4 in the middle of the R5?

I do wish they had built the Swampoodle connection, though.

Also, looking at the Vuchic map-- does the connection between the two branches of the R6 actually exist or was that another planned connection that was never built?

Re: I agree with him almost entirely...

Date: 2011-01-28 10:00 pm (UTC)
ext_248645: (Default)
From: [identity profile] indecisionwins.livejournal.com
does the connection between the two branches of the R6 actually exist or was that another planned connection that was never built?

If I understand your question, that change was actually because they stopped running over the Schuylkill River bridge in Manayunk at some point (in the 80's?) because it was declared unsafe. So the (now Cynwyd) R6 actually did run to Ivy Ridge at one point... (I think it went to a different station, or maybe a different track in the same station?)

Re: I agree with him almost entirely...

Date: 2011-01-28 11:26 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] eclectic-boy.livejournal.com
>what was with the little bit of R4 in the middle of the R5?

Look again at that map. It has no R8. The R4 line contained the R8's Fox Chase half and then continued along the Main Line as far as Bryn Mawr. The R5 was to run always-express, skipping everything between Bryn Mawr and Center City.

Re: I agree with him almost entirely...

Date: 2011-01-29 03:16 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] david chaplin-loebell (from livejournal.com)
Still doesn't make sense to me. There's only one branch on the map-- outside the center city zone-- that has more than one R number on the same piece of track. It's inconsistent and confusing.

You could argue that the same problem applies to the RRR lines between Market East and Glenside, but those three lines do split off into separate branches eventually. The R4 and R5 are running on the same track!

Re: I agree with him almost entirely...

Date: 2011-01-29 12:57 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] reldnahkram.livejournal.com
Going all the way back, the two branches of the old R6 were two lines operated by competing railroads, running all the way to Norristown. The Pennsylvania Railroad ran from the main line across the Pencoyd Viaduct (aka Manayunk Bridge), whereas the Reading line ran across North Philly. The PRR line was never as popular because it was slower, and it was cut back over the years. Most of that line is now the Schuylkill River Trail.

[livejournal.com profile] indecisionwins is correct, the line was cut back to Cynwyd when the bridge was called into question. The bridge was rehabed in the late 90s, but there has been no real consideration of restoring service. The Reading tracks provide a faster route to the major commuter destinations - Suburban and Market East. It was, however, included in one of the Schuylkill Valley Metro proposals.

Manayunk and Ivy Ridge were the only two stations on the east side of the river. Manayunk PRR was a block or so west of the RDG station, just past the end of the Main St corridor. The Ivy Ridge stations were very close but separated by a significant vertical distance. The PRR station was higher and had more parking; the RDG station now uses that parking and there's a flight of stairs between the parking and the station.

PRR Manayunk

Ivy Ridge

For completeness's sake, here's Barmouth Station, between Cynwyd and Manayunk. One look at the surroundings should make it obvious why service was cut back all the way to Cynwyd.

Date: 2011-01-28 08:47 pm (UTC)
crystalpyramid: crystal pyramid suspended in dimensional abnormality (Default)
From: [personal profile] crystalpyramid
Is there a reason he left the Delaware end of the formerly-R2 off his map? ::hurt::

Date: 2011-01-28 09:09 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] eclectic-boy.livejournal.com
Yes! Because that was as far south as the trains went when SEPTA adopted his system.

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